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Talk:Command
ARCHIVE PAGE 1 : Command and Conquer Wiki talk:Canon/Archive 1 Red Alert Before we do anything, we need to decide if TWI comes after the Allied RA1 campaign or the Soviet one. Then we can decide if we include RA2 or not. Whatever happens, Generals is rubbish, as normal (Ok it's fun, but the story is irrelevant to CnC Wiki. In case you were wondering, the GLA structures page here is a backup because the Wikipedia one was going to be deleted). Suggestions :RA2 and YR are not canonical. It was stated on Petroglyph forums that the RA2 storyline was the result of tinkering with time. Also, any possible connections are very shaky, as there is no plausible explanation for the loss of technology between RA2 and Tiberian Dawn. Move Fiend 09:40, 8 May 2007 (UTC) ::No Plausible Answer, Yes, yet we can still think of solution. Just "trash it" isn't going to solve anything. Great Depression after war is possible, as well as sabotage of NOD (just thinking) or simple burocrat dump might possible. YR was another factor in war, which later merged into RA era. Also the RA2 officially ended in mid-allied storyline. Also the tinkering with time is RA1, the experiment that started CnC universe. We are discussing RA2-Dawn connection. RA1 definitely will be included. --Kasugurami 09:46, 8 May 2007 (UTC) :::Any attempt to bind RA2 with the rest of the series needs a lot of creative writing, and this wiki will stop being an attempt to write down canonical works, but it will be "fanon" all the way. Also, RA2 DID NOT END IN MIDALLIED STORYLINE. Where'd you get that anyways? Move Fiend 09:51, 8 May 2007 (UTC) ::::What I meant was the Peace Treaty that virtually ended RA2 war between soviet-allied during Allied mission in YR. There was a defense mission of Peace Treaty Place, and at that point virtually RA2 storyline finished in YR. --Kasugurami 09:55, 8 May 2007 (UTC) :::::The storyline in RA2:YR is totally different from the one in RA2. While RA2 plays all through the GWWIII, YR begins shortly after the GWWIII started and overrides the rest of RA2. Move Fiend 09:57, 8 May 2007 (UTC) ::::::At the end of the YR-Allied, Time itself start to merge, and everything is one now. GWWIII did ended, with the factor of Yuri. Or at least the video clip at the end of YR-Allied campain implied to me --Kasugurami 09:59, 8 May 2007 (UTC) :::::::The timelines merged into a single ending, but as we can clearly see that Carville is alive and kicking, then the RA2:YR is the fully canonical version of the Great World War III. Move Fiend 10:02, 8 May 2007 (UTC) ::::::::The timeline merged into single ending, then it is the one it ends with. Just like Adolf Hitler faded away from history by chainging history of Dr. Einstein, YR just changed the course of history by time-travelling. Not to mention whole RA-RA2-Tiberium series is rooted by time travel --Kasugurami 10:07, 8 May 2007 (UTC) :::::::::The timelines merged into a single ending. The RA2:YR ending. Also, it's RA-Tibeirum series, not the other way round. If you want your theory to be plausible, you have to explain the loss of technology between RA2:YR and TD plausibly. Move Fiend 10:11, 8 May 2007 (UTC) ::::::::::never said it was other way. RA-(RA2/YR)-Tiberium or RA-Tiberium that we are debating about. So according to your ultimatum there is no negotiation for RA2 since we can't explain anything? :::::::::::Not ultimatum. My opinion. I'm not the founder here, but have contributed quite a bit, and my opinion is that RA2 should be kept separate, as there is currently no indication that it is part of the Tiberium Universe like RA is and that the loss of technology cannot beplausibly explained. Move Fiend 10:28, 8 May 2007 (UTC) ::::::::::::Best way to actually clear things up is hear from developer himself, yet it is kinda hard. In my opinion, for Tesla and Prism technology, it is being implanted on power plant and Obelisk of Nod, respectively. the real Nicolo Tesla was looking for cheap electricity source, and the tesla reactor proves it. conventional fire powerplants are just too much material-consuming (not suggesting that tiberium can be burnt to produce power), and nuclear power plant is too much costly to modern battlefield. Also hydropowerplants are just out of way. Prism technology is basically beam reflected each other to gather stronger beam. If that is concentrated on single collum, hoola, it is most powerful defense structure, the obelisk of nod. Of course nothing can be proven as you can say, and nothing is documented or shown in game for transition of RA2-Dawn or YR-Dawn. As mentioned, best way is to contact developer. Fan interview, or sort. --Kasugurami 10:38, 8 May 2007 (UTC) ::::::::::::If we absolutely have to take out RA2 from connecting Dawn, it is possible to make it Parallel-Universe Theory, where G8 formes GDI, or US alone stands Puppet Romanov. If that is not possible, and if I Absolutely have to strick out the RA2 out of the equation, I would go for Allied story of RA to Dawn, which, the original developers of westwood intended to do. I really wish westwood kept making CnC series. --Kasugurami 10:49, 8 May 2007 (UTC) :::::::::::::There is an alternate timeline namespace for RA2 already. As for the powerplant... keep in mind that the powerplants from Tiberian Dawn onwards are nuclear power plants, evidenced by the technical name the plant has in C&C1 (NUKE). As for the developers... I think the Petroglyph (where most devs are) already answered the questons on their forums. Move Fiend 11:50, 8 May 2007 (UTC) :If we imply the "alternate Universe" theory on All of CnC, can't we branch out the possibilities? RA could lead to RA2 and Dawn, respectively (Allied would be RA2 and soviet to be Dawn, or vice versa?) Dawn has its own story merging together which leads Kane's Ion Cannon. TS will have the "original storyline" following GDI stopping TS project of Kane, as well as the Nod storyline of TS project succeeds and Scrin would have came to harvest ichor anyway, just like TW. GDI TS storyline will follow the FS storyline which is self-merging. FS storyline will follow to TW, which is also self-merging, yet inconclusive in some ways. Only branch that contradicts in mission/ending is RA and TS. --Kasugurami 20:21, 8 May 2007 (UTC) Arguments for Allied ending leading onto TWI: *Good guys normally win. *World would be messed up if Soviets won, so how would GDI exist? *Most of the time, the 'Good Guys' ending is considered to be canon, such as with TS assuming GDI won TWI and FS assuming GDI again won TS. * As Russia is defeated there would be a power vaccuum for Nod to rise. In TD Nod is mostly active in the third world. Most of Europe and Russia are GDI territory. * From the allied ending there could be 2 paths. 1 leading to TS (where GDI is formed, Tiberium lands on the planet etc.), the other to RA2. Arguments for Sovet Ending *Cutscene implies that Kane takes over. *Which would give him the necessary influence to make Nod a world power. *If the Soviets "won" GWWII (Red Alert 1), they wouldn't take over the world- they would just be powerful. This is different from the Allied campaign, because if the Allies won the Soviets would be completely crushed. *If the Allies won GWWII and crushed the Soviets completely, then how would Nod come to be powerful if it has no Soviet powerbase. Current Conclusions (not final - Discuss them!! I suppose I am biased slightly towards my views...that's why this is a talk page. At the moment it seems the Allied ending would lead onto Red Alert 2. I.e. Allies set up Romanov as puppet, and Nod has no power so it never comes to anything. We need to come to a conclusion so this can become an official reference page (see Template:Help_Navigation). Snow93 12:14, 12 May 2006 (UTC) Response from Dthaiger The Allies win the Great World War II, which explains how GDI was started. Remember, it was Tiberium that made Nod a world power, rather than their already having the Soviet empire. Furthermore, they really didn't even have the Soviet power, ven if the Soviets won - because with the death of Stalin the Soviet Empire would be thrown into turmoil. One interesting idea is that GDI actually isn't a result of either the Allied or the Soviet campaigns - it's a result of the Ant missions, which would then be placed after the end of the Allied campaign. Evidence for this from a continuity perspective includes: Use of both Rangers (Humvees) and Mammoth Tanks on the same side (as well as other units, I'm not exactly sure, except therewas some crossover) The fact that both the United States and Russia are considered GDI strongholds during the First Tiberium War. The interesting fact that there were gold colored units during the Ant campaign - ie, GDI colors. The fact that GDI stared out as a Black Ops group. I'm almost certain that an operation like the ant missions would be handled by a black ops unit. --Dthaiger 01:00, 13 May 2006 (UTC). DarkMastero's Response Why not allow Generals articles anyway? Label them if you want though. I admit they don't seem to relate to the story line but it does bear the C&C logo. ---- CNC 3 Novel Cannoncity With the release date for the Command and Conquer 3 novel coming, editors should be prepared for a discussing concerning the canoncity of the novel's content. I'm sure with any spin-offs, there's going to be some issues with contradictory information. It's probably best to prepare ahead of time. --Eldarone 07:29, 28 May 2007 (UTC) I like your thinking - Planning ahead is always a good idea. Obviously, the characters will get their own sections, I guess. Hopefully, there won't be anything that's vastly contradictory. I'm not sure what Snow93 and iAgaiz think, but I know that for me, I think we should place the games first, and the novel second. --Dthaiger 07:58, 28 May 2007 (UTC) I would think the novel will follow a cannoncal line, at least about the major events. Though a novel where NOD beats the heck out of Lando would be funny. ^u^ DWolf2k2 15:14, 29 May 2007 (UTC) I suppose the novel should be considered canon as it's an official release. Mind you, if it's very, very different from the games (like the Doom novels) then we may have to consider otherwise. I mean, in the Doom novels the monsters aren't even from Hell (like the movie in fact). Makron1n 18:00, 29 May 2007 (UTC) :I agree that the novel would be canon, and should be used to fill in gaps within the Database. Hpwever, I also agree with Dthaiger that if any information shoud contradict, then the game information comes first. --Eldarone 15:35, 30 May 2007 (UTC) Strategy Guides What about information from the strategy guides? Are the names and information about units and battles in there considered Canon or what? DWolf2k2 16:04, 10 July 2007 (UTC) Real World History? I was wondering if we should add on a section describing how Real World information or History should be used as a canon source, or at least a source that can aid in speculation. --Eldarone 04:50, 14 November 2007 (UTC) :I am for it. Will make us that much more creadible and appealing :) Shaur M. S. Grizlin 08:41, 14 November 2007 (UTC) Red Alert 2 Either Soviet Campign took place or the Allied, it is no way they could happen BOTH....If Soviet Commander succeeded in all his missions there would be no Alled forces in Moscow there would be global World Socialist Alliance (and THATS the right ending (IMHO) Which ending for Uprising? Does anyone also think that the only campaign that will be canon in RA3 Uprising will be the Allies? They are the good guys, but their technology company has been experimenting on Soviet citizens, held a prison camp that freezes people, and almost eradicated the Soviets. Although, knowing ea, they will just say that they didn't do anything, and have the 2 factions suppressed. Or they could go the way of TD(All endings canon, except Allies ending), then it could lead to RA4. --~~ForcedDj~~ I dunno. I'd say that the Soviet and Yuriko campaigns of Uprising can exist without contradiction as they're generally self-contained. It's the Allies and Empire campaigns that are at odds though-I remember EA saying something about the "good guys" campaign always being canonical (e.g. the Allies and in a sense, GDI as per Dawn and Sun), though the Empire campaign being the canon path in Uprising would allow an easier setup for an RA4 IMO.--Hawki 13:54, 7 August 2009 (UTC) An easier way is having all 4 canon(the first 2 you said will be likely because they are their own and don't contradict). However, the Allies need to LOSE this time. They basically dominate the whole earth. They could make it look like GDI/they are sometimes viewed as oppressors, good guy image gets desecrated/destroyed. Or, they can have this happen: Allies stop 3 out of 4 empire commanders. They FAIL to stop the new emperor because they LOST the Chronosphere. The Allies detention camp gets raided(due to the other campaign) and the few commanders that are alive(most Soviet commanders in the camp are dead) escape. Their company that supplies them their technology manage to destroy the captured Chronosphere, but after they made the new one, they were disbanded for testing on innocent civilians(Soviet campaign). They are kicked out of both faction's countries and terrorities because their company disbanded and their army was stretched too much(or hell, I don't know, have them get kicked out of the enemy countries). There, RA4 can happen easier. At least in TW, GDI does win, but in a political or goal standpoint, GDI lost(they tried to destroy the tower and prevent Nod from retaking the Tactius, but failed). But, like I said, ea loves the Allies in campaigns. So the Allies get it, and thats it. If they do that, then the only way I might buy RA4 is if the Soviets or Empire or another faction defeats the Allies, or the Allies reputation/good guy image gets destroyed. Why do they always have the good guys campaign be canonical? --ForcedDj 07:15, 8 August 2009 (UTC) Since we have no info on which campaign(s) will end up being canonical, we must write and setup the wiki to be suitably ambiguous at this time. If you want to speculate, I suggest taking it to the forum. - Meco (talk) 04:22, 9 August 2009 (UTC) The Uprising's canon setting. First of all, remember that none of the campaigns interferes within each other. At this time, I consider an order by campaigns very adequate. This is: *Yuriko's campaign *Soviet campaign *Imperial campaign *Allied campaign This is specially due to the ending videos of the Soviet and Imperial campaigns. To re-build the Soviet Union, Oleg Vodnik and Nikolai Moskvin surely needed more territories. The Empire, for it's part, needed Vladivostok to regain some power. Also, it's highly possible that Tatsu didn't waste his loyal Shogun, as in the operation "The True Shogun's Stand" there are 2 Imperial VIP Bunkers: one for Takara's group and the other for Tatsu. We must discuss this carefully because if there will be RA4 (which I doubt), it will be released in several years after RA3 release. GralOsorio (talk) 23:24, January 10, 2013 (UTC) :Speaking of which, none of us can confirm the realease of RA4 unless it's official. By the way, that'd be a logical order for the RA3 story. Anyway, since Yuriko campaign is first, her first mission might be happened before the beginning of the War Of The Three Powers while the second one is just after the Allies occupied Japan. --Commander Ajikan 20:35, June 3, 2015 (UTC)